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If it's -30 + only use #1 diesel

Topic 17703 | Page 1

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Mr M's Comment
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Here's some advice don't even think about driving across -30 or colder with anything other than #1 diesel.

Sambo's Comment
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The way I understand it, gelling is caused by the Paraffin, or wax, found in diesel. #1 diesel has no wax in it, and thus has a lower gelling point. Am I mistaken?

Rick S.'s Comment
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Actually...

(my post from the other thread)

#1 - is often referred to as "Premium Diesel Fuel. It is NOT what we commonly call "Off Road" (or diesel fuel that has red dye to indicate is hasn't had the ROAD TAX collected on it). It is thinner and has a higher cetane rating (45 as opposed to 40 for regular old diesel).

Check out this article for a better description and comparison of diesel fuels. Flash Off Road About Diesel Fuel Article

I didn't think Mr. M was going to suggest that folks go out and break the law.

FYI - Off Road Red is typically the same as whatever the station is pumping - just that is has the dye added to indicate it is UNTAXED. Using untaxed fuel denies the state it's revenue of road taxes derived from fuel. There would be no advantage to using off road in colder weather - it likely has the same anti-gel as in the on-road diesel.

The problem with suggesting #1 Diesel is - it's not very common to find 2 grades of diesel at station pumps any more. 99% of truck stops are going to use #2, and will not have separate pumps for #1.

I can't really remember automotive fuel stops that were offering both grades of fuel in quite awhile either. Speaking for the SE - up north might be different.

Rick

murderspolywog's Comment
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I believe wax is only found in bio blends of fuel. If you can get strait #2 it would be wax free, the only places I have found strait #2 is in parts of NV and upstate NY, if your in WY shamrock fuel sells both #1 (labeled as off road), and #2 fuel as well as winter blend fuel.

Rick S.'s Comment
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So for example - the pump that does REEFER FUEL in the truck stop - is pumping "red dye untaxed fuel" - and it's the EXACT SAME FUEL you're filling your truck with - just that it has RED DYE and it's CHEAPER BECAUSE IT HAS NO ROAD TAX built into the price.

And like I said above - I am not all that sure you are going to find stations that have both #1 AND #2 diesel. Most "winter formulations" are supposedly a blend of #1 & #2 - with some anti-gel thrown in.

Once you get into the sub-0's - whether you can keep your diesel flowing is anybody's guess - which is why you should keep your engine running - so the heated fuel returning from the fuel rail to the tanks can keep things flowing.

Anything you choose to do - DON'T FORGET TO ADD ANTI-GEL TO YOUR REEFER TANK ALSO.

Rick

Reefer:

A refrigerated trailer.

OWI:

Operating While Intoxicated

OOS:

When a violation by either a driver or company is confirmed, an out-of-service order removes either the driver or the vehicle from the roadway until the violation is corrected.

murderspolywog's Comment
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Very interesting article I kind of wonder if, deisel changed with the 07 EPA regs. We used to run #1 and jet fuel in are trucks, then we got the new EPA engines on some of are trucks back in 09 and had to switch to #2 because the other stuff was burning to hot and we burned the valves on one of the moters, boss not happy.

Patrick C.'s Comment
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Speaking of Jet fuel. Jet fuel is more on par with unleaded kerosene. But with antimicrobial and anti-gel additives (Prist) as well as combustion stabilizers. For you ex military folks JP-4 is more on par with Jet A-1 (civilian jet fuel). JP-8 sits in between Jet A and Diesel. As example avg weight of #2 diesel is roughly 7.1 lbs / gal. #1 diesel is roughly 7.0 lbs / gal. JP-8 is 6.7 lbs / gal. JP-4 (Jet A) is 6.5 lbs / gal. As comparison examples: Kerosene is 6.8 lbs / gal. Gasoline is 6.2 lbs / gal. The more refined (and explosive) fuel is the lighter it gets.

Sorry about all the lbs / gal. I spent over 13 years in aviation in the Army. In aircraft fuel is tracked by weight not volume. For example: a UH-60 Blackhawk helicopter has 2 181 gallon tanks. 362 gallons of fuel. Only 360 gallons are useable since each tank has a 1 gal sump, on average when completely full we should see 2,420 lbs of fuel on board. In cold weather you can easily fit 2,480 lbs of fuel. In the desert you more than likely see 2,360 lbs of fuel. Got to love the laws of Thermodynamics.

Mr M's Comment
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Red dielsel is not #1. Red is also farm diesel. #1 just cost more. I had my #2 diesel treated and it still gelled. Then when i hit slc got the filter changed mechanic said he treated the fuel and it still gelled.

Mr M's Comment
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Also notice I said - 30 or colder in subject the second time i gelled my truck was not only running but I was drivi ng it. First time truck never shut off either

Rick S.'s Comment
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And to reiterate - RED (off road/farm) is THE SAME AS #2 PUMP DIESEL (or whatever weather blend is being sold/delivered).

And you are really NOT going to find #1 at a pump in very many places. Plus #1 lubricates significantly less - and can potential cause mechanical issues.

In cold weather you can easily fit 2,480 lbs of fuel. In the desert you more than likely see 2,360 lbs of fuel. Got to love the laws of Thermodynamics.

This is similar to the problems (lawsuits) some truckstops were under for selling "Hot Fuel". Diesel (well, all actually) EXPANDS as the ambient/stored temps go up - and what "looks like" a gallon at 100 degrees fuel temp - is actually significantly less at 50 degrees.

Rick

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
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