TruckingTruth logo

Logbook Rules: How Would You Make Them Better?

Topic 19576 | Page 2

Page 2 of 5 Previous Page Next Page Go To Page:
MC1371's Comment
member avatar

I would switch it back to exactly as you described but add the 34 hour reset. However, I don't think they would ever do that because it would only make sense - cant have that.

So I would:

Increase the 14 hour clock into a 16 hour clock to accomodate some of the issues described above.

Increase the 11 hour clock to a 12 hour clock to allow for more drivetime.

8 hour break remains.

34 hour reset remains.

As a result of the 14 hour clock increasing by 2 hours, I would completely remove the Split Sleeper Berth provision.

Add an additonal duty status called Off-Duty Break abbreviated as ODB. ODB will pause the 16 hour clock for up to 4 hours, after the 4th hour the 16 hour clock will resume and behave like the current 14 hour clock.

ODB is a duty status strictly for sleeping periods when the driver is too fatigued to safely continue driving. If used in any other way, it is an HoS violation.

I like Dan's suggestion.

And if all that is too hard. There has to be an option to pause the 14. And not just the 2 hr exemption for weather unforseen events.

Best example I have for this is a pick up I had in Buffalo. Nearest real truck stop is in PA about an hour away.

I get to the customer and find out min 7 hour delay. Bam. I'm trapped, weather I go find a place to park or stay there my entire day is shot. By the time I'm loaded I'll have 2hrs to find somewhere else to park.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
G-Town's Comment
member avatar

Daniel wrote:

I would switch it back to exactly as you described but add the 34 hour reset. However, I don't think they would ever do that because it would only make sense - cant have that.

So I would:

Increase the 14 hour clock into a 16 hour clock to accomodate some of the issues described above.

Increase the 11 hour clock to a 12 hour clock to allow for more drivetime.

8 hour break remains.

34 hour reset remains.

As a result of the 14 hour clock increasing by 2 hours, I would completely remove the Split Sleeper Berth provision.

Add an additonal duty status called Off-Duty Break abbreviated as ODB. ODB will pause the 16 hour clock for up to 4 hours, after the 4th hour the 16 hour clock will resume and behave like the current 14 hour clock.

ODB is a duty status strictly for sleeping periods when the driver is too fatigued to safely continue driving. If used in any other way, it is an HoS violation.

You have my vote!

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
millionmiler24's Comment
member avatar

Years ago the logbook rules were much better, in my opinion, than they are today. Basically:

  • You could drive up to 10 hours before requiring an 8 hour break
  • You could split your sleeper berth and driving time into two segments, as long as each segment in the sleeper berth was a minimum of 2 hours
  • The 70 hour rule was the same as it is today. You can be on duty up to 70 hours every 8 days

The 14 hour rule did not exist, the 30 minute break was not required, and the 34 hour reset did not exist. You could still drive about the same number of miles back then as you can today, but the split sleeper berth rule and the lack of a 14 hour rule gave you far more flexibility than you have today.

The split sleeper berth was very simple. Start with an example:

  • Drive 4 hours
  • Sleep 3 hours
  • Drive up to 6 more hours, for a total of 10 when combined with your last drive segment
  • Sleep a minimum of 5 hours, for a total of 8 when combined with your last sleep segment

So when you add your last two driving time segments they can not total more than 10 hours. When you add your last two sleeper berth periods they must total a minimum of 8 hours.

At anytime you could take a complete 8 hour break and that would reset your 10 hours of drive time.

I would have added the 34 hour reset to those rules, and in my opinion they would have been as perfect as I know how to make them.

For those of you who have been out there on the road for a little while, what would you do with the logbook rules if it were up to you?

How I would do it is:

Totally OBLITERATE the 14 hour rule. Have 12 hours on duty each day and 12 hours combined off duty/sleeper berth. The only things you log on duty not driving would be pretrip, fueling, and post trip. As soon as you arrive at a shipper or receiver, switch to off duty and send in an arrival macro to your dispatcher to let them know you arent just loafing around. Anytime you stop for a break and you switch to off duty/sleeper berth, it STOPS your 12 hour clock and doesn't affect it until you have 12 hours off duty or sleeper berth. Then it will reset back to 12 or whatever you have left on your 60, whatever is less. When you hit 60 hours each week, do a 48 hour uninterrupted reset. In other words have the weekends off or something that resembles a weekend off, two days off in a row. Also any hours logged above 40 each week should be paid at time and a half. In other words whatever your cpm rate is, add half of that to your current cpm rate and any on duty time logged after that should be paid at the higher rate.

HOS is one of the things I noticed confuses a lot of new drivers. I would recommend implementing the above changes to make it so much easier to get things done.

Logbook:

A written or electronic record of a driver's duty status which must be maintained at all times. The driver records the amount of time spent driving, on-duty not driving, in the sleeper berth, or off duty. The enforcement of the Hours Of Service Rules (HOS) are based upon the entries put in a driver's logbook.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Dispatcher:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.

CPM:

Cents Per Mile

Drivers are often paid by the mile and it's given in cents per mile, or cpm.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
millionmiler24's Comment
member avatar

That new method would also make it a lot easier for a new driver to transition from a standard 40 hr a week job into a trucking job.

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

Cystuartfi wrote:

Totally OBLITERATE the 14 hour rule. Have 12 hours on duty each day and 12 hours combined off duty/sleeper berth. The only things you log on duty not driving would be pretrip, fueling, and post trip. As soon as you arrive at a shipper or receiver, switch to off duty and send in an arrival macro to your dispatcher to let them know you arent just loafing around. Anytime you stop for a break and you switch to off duty/sleeper berth, it STOPS your 12 hour clock and doesn't affect it until you have 12 hours off duty or sleeper berth. Then it will reset back to 12 or whatever you have left on your 60, whatever is less. When you hit 60 hours each week, do a 48 hour uninterrupted reset. In other words have the weekends off or something that resembles a weekend off, two days off in a row. Also any hours logged above 40 each week should be paid at time and a half. In other words whatever your cpm rate is, add half of that to your current cpm rate and any on duty time logged after that should be paid at the higher rate.

That's okay for OTR work, but on many Dedicated assignments (specifically retail store delivery), reduces the amount of work that can be accomplished in a day. I cannot log off-duty when I deliver to Walmart's. The live-unload requires the driver to be attentive to the operation and at times for a perishable reefer load, supervise what comes off and what goes back on. Many times 12 hours isn't enough time to complete a 6-stop load, the type that earns the highest pay.

I still believe Daniel's suggestion can satisfy the needs of most Interstate drivers; OTR, Regional and/or Dedicated.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Regional:

Regional Route

Usually refers to a driver hauling freight within one particular region of the country. You might be in the "Southeast Regional Division" or "Midwest Regional". Regional route drivers often get home on the weekends which is one of the main appeals for this type of route.

OTR:

Over The Road

OTR driving normally means you'll be hauling freight to various customers throughout your company's hauling region. It often entails being gone from home for two to three weeks at a time.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Interstate:

Commercial trade, business, movement of goods or money, or transportation from one state to another, regulated by the Federal Department Of Transportation (DOT).

Dispatcher:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.

CPM:

Cents Per Mile

Drivers are often paid by the mile and it's given in cents per mile, or cpm.

Reefer:

A refrigerated trailer.

Unholychaos's Comment
member avatar

Still a rookie so all I ever knew is what is current, and the only thing I'd change is the 14h rule. Make it not tick away while off duty/sleeper berth. I personally don't mind being restricted to 14h days since it allows me to start early in the day and end early enough to where I'll almost always have an easy place to park in a truck stop while still having a productive day.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Fatsquatch 's Comment
member avatar

The only two things that really aggravate me are the 14 hr rule and the 30 minute break. Get rid of those, and I'd be happy.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
Brett Aquila's Comment
member avatar
Increase the 14 hour clock into a 16 hour clock to accommodate some of the issues described above.

So Daniel, I'm assuming you'd want this rule to make sure that every driver is parked for 8 consecutive hours at least once in each 24 hour period? I think that's reasonable, but it still worries me that it forces people to keep running when they really would be better off stopping for whatever reason.

I hadn't considered it until now, but I think it would be reasonable to say that if using the old rules, a driver can only use the split sleeper berth for one cycle, and then the next time they park they must take 8 consecutive hours off. That way you wouldn't have people doing two or three straight days of shorter sleep cycles.

I just worry that any type of 14 or 16 hour rule will force people to keep running for far too long.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Isaac H.'s Comment
member avatar

And that is exactly correct gtown. There are the otr drivers that just drive,drive, drive drop and hook , and there are otr drivers that deliver, deliver, drive a little and deliver. And everything in between.

How are you going to come up with one set of rules for everybody?

Are you going to tell every pitcher in baseball that they are required to pitch 5 innings? The starters would be like "yeah! Only 5 innings" and the closers are going to be like " 5 innings is too much! "

Wish i had an answer, lol.

Cystuartfi wrote:

double-quotes-start.png

Totally OBLITERATE the 14 hour rule. Have 12 hours on duty each day and 12 hours combined off duty/sleeper berth. The only things you log on duty not driving would be pretrip, fueling, and post trip. As soon as you arrive at a shipper or receiver, switch to off duty and send in an arrival macro to your dispatcher to let them know you arent just loafing around. Anytime you stop for a break and you switch to off duty/sleeper berth, it STOPS your 12 hour clock and doesn't affect it until you have 12 hours off duty or sleeper berth. Then it will reset back to 12 or whatever you have left on your 60, whatever is less. When you hit 60 hours each week, do a 48 hour uninterrupted reset. In other words have the weekends off or something that resembles a weekend off, two days off in a row. Also any hours logged above 40 each week should be paid at time and a half. In other words whatever your cpm rate is, add half of that to your current cpm rate and any on duty time logged after that should be paid at the higher rate.

double-quotes-end.png

That's okay for OTR work, but on many Dedicated assignments (specifically retail store delivery), reduces the amount of work that can be accomplished in a day. I cannot log off-duty when I deliver to Walmart's. The live-unload requires the driver to be attentive to the operation and at times for a perishable reefer load, supervise what comes off and what goes back on. Many times 12 hours isn't enough time to complete a 6-stop load, the type that earns the highest pay.

I still believe Daniel's suggestion can satisfy the needs of most Interstate drivers; OTR, Regional and/or Dedicated.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Regional:

Regional Route

Usually refers to a driver hauling freight within one particular region of the country. You might be in the "Southeast Regional Division" or "Midwest Regional". Regional route drivers often get home on the weekends which is one of the main appeals for this type of route.

OTR:

Over The Road

OTR driving normally means you'll be hauling freight to various customers throughout your company's hauling region. It often entails being gone from home for two to three weeks at a time.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Interstate:

Commercial trade, business, movement of goods or money, or transportation from one state to another, regulated by the Federal Department Of Transportation (DOT).

Dispatcher:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.

CPM:

Cents Per Mile

Drivers are often paid by the mile and it's given in cents per mile, or cpm.

Reefer:

A refrigerated trailer.

Drop And Hook:

Drop and hook means the driver will drop one trailer and hook to another one.

In order to speed up the pickup and delivery process a driver may be instructed to drop their empty trailer and hook to one that is already loaded, or drop their loaded trailer and hook to one that is already empty. That way the driver will not have to wait for a trailer to be loaded or unloaded.

John S.'s Comment
member avatar

Sounds like you want the Canadian HOS rules.

14hrs on-duty, 13hrs driving. You can extend the workday to 16 hrs with 2 hrs worth of breaks (of at least 30 min long each). You need to have 8hrs consecutive break. Can split sleeper in two any which way.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
Page 2 of 5 Previous Page Next Page Go To Page:

New Reply:

New! Check out our help videos for a better understanding of our forum features

Bold
Italic
Underline
Quote
Photo
Link
Smiley
Links On TruckingTruth


example: TruckingTruth Homepage



example: http://www.truckingtruth.com
Submit
Cancel

Need help? We have instructions for sharing photos from photo sharing sites



example: http://www.truckingtruth.com/images/header.jpg
Submit
Cancel

Click on any of the buttons below to insert a link to that section of TruckingTruth:

Getting Started In Trucking High Road Training Program Company-Sponsored Training Programs Truck Driver's Career Guide Choosing A School Choosing A Company Truck Driving Schools Truck Driving Jobs Apply For Truck Driving Jobs DOT Physical Drug Testing Items To Pack Pre-Hire Letters CDL Practice Tests Trucking Company Reviews Brett's Book Leasing A Truck Pre-Trip Inspection Learn The Logbook Rules Sleep Apnea
Done
Done

0 characters so far - 5,500 maximum allowed.
Submit Preview

Preview:

Submit
Cancel

Join Us!

We have an awesome set of tools that will help you understand the trucking industry and prepare for a great start to your trucking career. Not only that, but everything we offer here at TruckingTruth is 100% free - no strings attached! Sign up now and get instant access to our member's section:
High Road Training Program Logo
  • The High Road Training Program
  • The High Road Article Series
  • The Friendliest Trucker's Forum Ever!
  • Email Updates When New Articles Are Posted

About Us

TruckingTruth was founded by Brett Aquila (that's me!), a 15 year truck driving veteran, in January 2007. After 15 years on the road I wanted to help people understand the trucking industry and everything that came with the career and lifestyle of an over the road trucker. We'll help you make the right choices and prepare for a great start to your trucking career.

Read More

Becoming A Truck Driver

Becoming A Truck Driver is a dream we've all pondered at some point in our lives. We've all wondered if the adventure and challenges of life on the open road would suit us better than the ordinary day to day lives we've always known. At TruckingTruth we'll help you decide if trucking is right for you and help you get your career off to a great start.

Learn More