Comments By Nicholas H.

Hey Nicholas, we're glad you're here - Welcome aboard!

Now, I know you are a smart guy, but the difficulties have nothing to do with how intelligent one is. I went to college and owned a manufacturing business for thirty years. After doing those things I decided to do this gig for a second career, and I enjoy it very much. Even more than my enjoyment of this career is the enjoyment I get from helping folks understand how to make a start at this. One thing I can assure you that will not give you an accurate assessment of where you want to start is a spread sheet! I know you are thinking I'm crazy right now, but I'm hoping I can prove my point to you before you waste a lot of precious time at this. You simply cannot put together accurate information or parameters that will give you anything helpful in the end. All those crazy internet reviews you are going to find simply cannot be counted as even being close to accurate. Those reviews are almost all written by the approximately 95% of the folks who failed at this career. That information cannot help you, unless you just want to know how to fail at this.

Consider this: We have in this very forum several successful drivers who have been with Swift for years now! We have successful drivers in here from CR England! Hey, while I'm at this take a look at this link and tell me if you have ever heard anything like this about CR England? I started my career at Western Express, spent sixteen months there, and would be there still, had I not gotten an outstanding offer from Knight to work on a dedicated flat-bed account for them. Haha, try finding a good review of Western Express! I was very successful there because I understood how this whole thing works. Check out my comments in This Thread to have a better understanding of the kinds of things I'm trying to stress to you.

Are you aware of how competitive this business is? I'm not talking about competition between the companies. I'm referring to competition among the drivers to keep themselves at the top of the food chain. You simply can't take some losers account of how his trucking company starved him out by not giving him any miles, when there are other drivers at the same company who are giving it all they can just to get their work load completed. This whole business is performance based, and those who produce results continue to have great support and guidance from the folks who count on them to "git er done." There is no arbitrary fairness among dispatchers when it comes to keeping their drivers busy. When they know a driver who can be counted on no matter what, that driver will be called upon continually as long as he can keep the results pouring in. This is the kind of stuff that few understand when they decide they want to become a truck driver, but it is the stuff that makes for success at this.

I actually get tickled when I see the new folks coming in here talking about making spread sheets. That's not an insult. If anything, I realize that you are doing what you know best, as a way to make the proper decision. I know I probably have not dissuaded you from the whole spread sheet analysis, but I just want you to realize that what you put into this career as "effort to succeed" will far outweigh all your analysis at the beginning of your quest. When it comes to success at this career it has nothing to do with whose name is on the doors of the truck, and everything to do with what type of person is in the driver's seat.

LMAO. I gave up the spreadsheet about half an hour ago! Hahaha. Interesting that you mention how working for companies like CR England or Western Express can be positive, when all I've come across are negative reviews. I guess I have to do a bit more research on them.

I'm thinking that the bottom line in making the choice of which company to work for is the pay after training. It would need to be over 40 cpm. Would you agree, or do you think there's more to the equation?

Nicholas wrote:

I see that Swift does not have APU's, and although you say they are more trouble than they are worth, most of what I've seen says your life will be absolute hell on the road if you don't have an APU. They also have a 2 year contract, which I wouldn't sign.

Swift DOES NOT require a 2 year contractual commitment, it's a one year contract when you go through their training. For one year they will deduct $37.50 from each paycheck. During the second year they will deposit the same amount back into each paycheck until there is a zero balance. If you chose to leave after completion of one year, you owe them nothing. If you choose like I did and many others I personally know, once you hit 24 months the training is free.

Why do you think you need an APU? All of the newer trucks have bunk heaters for the winter. In the heat of the summer a driver is permitted to idle or what is known as optimized idle for running the AC. My life has been far from an "absolute hell" as you put it. Very few companies have APUs. The majority do not. Again. to reiterate, be careful believing everything you hear, many times it's pure unadulterated bull.

Nicholas also wrote:

That's the only thing holding me back right now, as I see other companies with only 2 weeks of training after obtaining the CDL, which would be great. On the other hand, I don't know if I'd be ready to go out on my own after only 2 weeks of training, so there's a fine line to walk there. I think a month would be ideal.

Two weeks is no where near enough for a student driver. Although a month is better, but still IMO (based on experience) is not enough. 6-8 weeks is about average. And you may believe that 6-8 weeks is plenty, the first three months is very difficult and will challenge your every skill, patience, nerve, and mental toughness. Just ask any of the folks on this forum less than 6 months into their first year,...ask them what it's like. They'll tell yah...

If Prime is your "primary" candidate, search on Rainy's Training Diary. Rainy is a Prime driver with close to a year of experience. Her training diary is informative, entertaining and dead-nuts truthful. I think it will give you a really good understanding of what to expect.

Thanks for the feedback. It seems like, from what you've said, an APU is not a necessity. I was just going off the opinion of some YouTube truckers, who obviously have more experience than me. I'd like to refrigerate fresh vegetables (to avoid the ever present weight gain and metabolic syndrome so prevalent among truckers) and have a microwave and laptop on board. I really have no idea how an APU works or whether it's a necessity, I was just basing that on people who have experience on the road. Thanks for the Rainy's Diary suggestion, I'll give that a whirl!

Yeah, I agree that even 8 weeks of training won't leave me prepared to handle all the things that OTR will throw at me, but any longer than that having to listen to someone else's choice in music and smelling them and just being around someone that long seems like pure hell.

Nicholas, why don't you forget about company-sponsored training and just pay for private schooling so you can do whatever you want to afterward? You're wasting all sorts of time reading reviews and pondering different aspects of different companies when you really don't want to be on the road or work for any of them. You're trying to force a square peg through a round hole.

Just save a little money or sell a couple of things and pay for an inexpensive but legitimate private school and then you're free to go work anywhere you like.

I can assure you that none of the company-sponsored programs want you to pay up front for the schooling and then leave. Some of them allow you to do it, but most don't. If they thought there was good money to make running truck driving schools they'd own a bunch of schools and wouldn't bother hauling freight. So whether you go through company-sponsored schooling and quit the company or go to a private school you're going to pay for the training either way. So just go with a private school and your options for where you go to work are open to you.

Thanks for the response, Brett. Great site! It's been my main source for research the past month. The local school in my area, Dutchess School of Driving, charges $6,300 for the CDL A training. Plus, it takes 2 months because it's a less intensive commuter school. I can't afford that, as I've been unemployed for quite some time now, and would actually rather just do the sleep-away company school and get it over and done with, road test and all, in 3-4 weeks. I can save up about $3,000 to pay for CDL school but haven't come across and intensive sleep away schools at all, and they would have to be in that price range. The best bet seems to be to go with a cheap school, i.e. Celadon, Millis, Knight, or Prime, and just pay it back if you leave before the contract ends. But the more I think about it, the more I think I would love OTR, and would have no problem getting through the year long contract. My fiance would be a different story, but I told her she can leave me at anytime if she's not happy, and that I'm doing this to make an investment in our future while we still have no kids to worry about.

Pay after training is probably the biggest issue now that I've seen some responses saying APU's aren't a necessity. I'd like to sign with a company that pays at least 40 cpm after training, and that looks pretty rare actually. I've also heard that it's dependent on the type of hauling, and saw a video saying that Prime pays something like 48 cpm if you drive tanker. So why not just choose to drive tanker then? There's a lot of lingering questions and unknowns, but your site is by far the best source of info I've found so far. Thanks!

Another big factor I'm thinking about, after doing some research, is forced dispatch. Unfortunately, Prime has forced dispatch. Any opinions on whether that's really a big factor? If I'm not feeling well-rested, or am too tired to keep driving like that guy Abe on 20/20, and the dispatcher forces me to drive, and I refuse and get fired and then owe the entire CDL School cost out of pocket, it seems like a raw deal.

Nicholas wrote:

Thanks. Of those listed, Knight, England, Palmer, Roehl and Pam are listed on this site as having Sponsored CDL Training. CR England is an immediate no go, based on the reviews I've read. Palmer and Pam look pretty good, and Knight and Roehl look better to me. I think Roehl is the best of that bunch as they pay $500 a week during CDL training, compared to Knight's $300 a week. I'd have to actually sit down and make a spreadsheet comparing all the company's pay when training is over, length of training, if you're solo immediately after training, home time, APU trucks, drop and hook %, etc... I would do that based on the info found here, I wish Brett had one made already ;-)

Nicholas with all due respect, be careful about the internet reviews that you read (or what you have heard), suggest to take all of it with at least a "grain of salt" or the entire "shaker". Those reviews are typically written by former, disgruntled employees who'd rather run their prior company into the ground, embellish the truth, than accept any accountability or responsibility for their failures and incompetence. For every example of bad press that's out there, we'll give you multiple examples of true success stories in here.

Your point about sponsored training? You missed Swift. They are probably the largest in that category. I attended one of their schools well over four years ago,...thought it was a great experience. By choice I continue to drive for Swift...no intention of looking elsewhere. Compare "that" to what is written about them on the internet...

The reason Brett hasn't made that spread sheet? Much of the information you defined isn't relevant or track-able or it changes like the weather. For instance "drop and hook %"; as an OTR driver that can vary day-to-day and is in no way an indication of what to expect for a given company. That can also vary for a given customer. APU's aren't required and in many cases are more trouble than they are worth because they break.

I sent you this a while ago: Trucking Company Reviews. Much of what you are seeking that's important is in there. I suggest giving it a thorough review. Same for the other stuff we sent you...your expectations will be better grounded after you review all of that.

Good luck...you seem engaged in this, that's a good thing.

Thanks for the info. I've reviewed all of the companies in the Company Sponsored CDL School section of this site, multiple times, over the past month. Although I've gone back and forth, after looking at a lot of people's experiences, I've decided that the company must have APU's on all trucks, and even EPU's are not acceptable. I see that Swift does not have APU's, and although you say they are more trouble than they are worth, most of what I've seen says your life will be absolute hell on the road if you don't have an APU. They also have a 2 year contract, which I wouldn't sign.

Another one of the biggest factors, for me at least, is what you owe the company if you leave after, say, 6 months. I see lots of jobs in my area that require 6 months of driving experience, and if I'm not enjoying OTR, I can always do it for 6 months and then leave. The only company I've seen that doesn't deduct training from your paycheck, but does cut your payback obligation in half after 6 months of driving, is Prime. Plus, they have APU's on all trucks. Although their 40,000 mile training period is a bit longer than other companies, I guess I can put up with some dude's farts and bad breath, and bad taste in music, for 2-3 months. The closer it gets to 3 months, the less tolerable it will be. That's the only thing holding me back right now, as I see other companies with only 2 weeks of training after obtaining the CDL, which would be great. On the other hand, I don't know if I'd be ready to go out on my own after only 2 weeks of training, so there's a fine line to walk there. I think a month would be ideal.

Nicholas, yes Prime is a good choice and one that many of our forum members have taken. However it's not the only "good" option, as we also have a good number of members from Schneider, Knight, CR England, Swift, XPO, Old Dominion, Jim Palmer, Roehl, and PAM (actually a longer list than this).

Lots of options, spelled out here: Trucking Company Reviews

Thanks. Of those listed, Knight, England, Palmer, Roehl and Pam are listed on this site as having Sponsored CDL Training. CR England is an immediate no go, based on the reviews I've read. Palmer and Pam look pretty good, and Knight and Roehl look better to me. I think Roehl is the best of that bunch as they pay $500 a week during CDL training, compared to Knight's $300 a week. I'd have to actually sit down and make a spreadsheet comparing all the company's pay when training is over, length of training, if you're solo immediately after training, home time, APU trucks, drop and hook %, etc... I would do that based on the info found here, I wish Brett had one made already ;-)

Welcome Nicholas.

Not sure if any of the Paid CDL Training Programs would allow you to pre-pay for the school with the intent of leaving to go home, finding a local job. Even if they did, I would not recommend taking that route. These programs are designed to prepare new drivers for hire into their respective companies. The other aspect of this to keep in mind, just because you have your CDL does not make you a truck driver. You know enough and only have the very basic of basic skills necessary to pass the CDL exams. All of the companies offering sponsored schooling will road train a new driver for a period of 1-3 months before considering the possibility of solo promotion. The "real" learning occurs with the road training. Not to be skipped.

I don't want to discourage you but local work is many times far too difficult for a new driver to handle. Although there are exceptions to this, we usually recommend at least 3-6 months OTR before attempting a local gig as a new driver.

I also suggest investing some time reading and reviewing these links:

• Truck Driver's Career Guide
• Brett's Book: The Raw Truth About Trucking (free online version)
• High Road Training Program

The first two links offer a truthful, accurate depiction of life as a truck driver. It will help you establish a realistic set of expectations and goals as you move into and progress through your first year. High Road is TT's comprehensive training program designed to prepare you for the CDL Permit Exams and other trucking subjects relevant to your learning curve.

Good luck and don't be afraid to ask questions. We are here to help.

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I see what you mean. The training after obtaining the CDL is the most important part, and isn't something I'd like to miss out on. The only reason I wouldn't opt for Celadon if I chose to stick with the company, is because they force you to team up even after training for at least 6 months. I definitely want to be on my own after training, as I love being alone, which is one of the reasons I want to be a trucker. That's why I'm leaning towards Prime. They let you go solo after 2 months of training. I couldn't handle any longer than that with someone else, smelling their farts and bad breath. Plus, if you leave after 6 months, they only make you pay half of school costs, ~$1700. Personally, I wouldn't mind staying OTR, but the fiance is giving me a hard time lol. Thanks for the links too, will definitely be helpful!

Wow - a LAWYER wanting to be a truck driver?

That bad, eh?

You typically won't find any "company training" that you can just use to TRAIN and pay them off to leave. They are looking to have you IN THE DRIVERS SEAT for (usually) at least a year - this allows them to re-coup their investment in training and offset the increased cost of insuring an inexperienced driver.

You are NOT LIKELY TO FIND A LOCAL JOB THAT REQUIRES ZERO EXPERIENCE. Most of these type jobs hire from within (as in, off the loading docks - think UPS/Fedex and other LTL carriers).

How old are you (if you don't mind my asking) and what is steering you away from a profession you have already spent a ton of time & $$ to get into?

You know the earning potential for a truck driver is still a bunch less than a lawyer (or even an experienced paralegal), and most local jobs tend to be P&D (pickup & delivery) which also means MANUAL LABOR.

Rick

Thanks for the response. Yeah, pretty much all the local jobs on Craigslist require at least 6 months-1 year experience, some 3 years. I did see a couple saying no experience necessary, but those were from Western Express and USExpress, and likely just OTR positions.

I'm 31, graduated from law school in 2010, and never made more than $40K a year as an attorney. On top of that, I live in a remote area in upstate NY with no job opportunities. Everything is in NYC. If I wanted to move out of state, I'd have to retake the Bar Exam or go through a laborious reciprocity application. To boot, I HATE going to court and writing, lol. I love driving and listening to podcasts, so it seems like Trucking is in my blood.

Although first year as a trucker is usually $40K tops, you can get over $100K with years of experience, which is something I'd never make as an attorney, unless I worked in a big firm working more hours than a trucker, which I definitely would not do. I can't stand wearing a suit and tie.

Do any of the companies have an issue with you paying for their CDL school up-front, then going home after you get your CDL? I've read all the reviews here for the company sponsored schools, and it looks like Celadon has the lowest cost CDL school with $2,600. That's much cheaper than a local school. So I'd like to just go do their training and get my CDL, then come home and find a local job that requires no driving experience. I just got engaged, and want to be home every night, or as close thereto as possible. I'm an attorney seeking a career-change. Thoughts? Think I'd be better off just going over the road for 6-months to a year? Thanks!