Drivers Guaranteed Pay For All On-Duty Hours - Transportation Bill

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David G.'s Comment
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What do you think of the transportation bill that has in it a guaranteed pay for drivers of all on-duty hours?

Rich D.'s Comment
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What do you think of the transportation bill that has in it a guaranteed pay for drivers of all on-duty hours?

I think its wonderful but they wont pass it. I can see lobbyist right now putting a stake in it. Big trucking companies have big money they cut rates by depriving drivers of pay. Basically the industry has a revolving door. That's why all these companies hire all the time. Drivers recruiters make money on referrals and lies, companies get a tax break for the new hires. win win _ for them.

Rich D.'s Comment
member avatar

If this was a fair paying industry retention would be higher. Company drivers against owner operators/ lease drivers mentalty has been the norm for decades. I don't understand a man that puts his truck on a company that has company trucks, and forced dispatch to boot, or a driver that rents a truck from a company.

I see in the future we all will be owner operators. Regulations are getting stiffer. Last year was a good year for owner operators because of fuel prices. That .80 cent + difference in diesel and gas doesn't mean a hill of beans in a regular slow market. I see surcharges disappearing and freight shifting to the big company that does it first.

Owner Operator:

An owner-operator is a driver who either owns or leases the truck they are driving. A self-employed driver.

SAP:

Substance Abuse Professional

The Substance Abuse Professional (SAP) is a person who evaluates employees who have violated a DOT drug and alcohol program regulation and makes recommendations concerning education, treatment, follow-up testing, and aftercare.

James K.'s Comment
member avatar

What do you think of the transportation bill that has in it a guaranteed pay for drivers of all on-duty hours?

Companies have the money to pay their drivers more and they just pocket it instead. The the way it should be, the drivers should be paid for being on duty because thats where they get screwed This is like someone going to work and at work but talking to someone and not actually working but they are paid to be there. Sitting for hours waiting for loads, dealing with dispatchers that are dumber than rocks and assigning phantom loads. I mean these companies are so damn cheap when it comes to their drivers. Making 50k a year is nice but when you think about the hours a driver puts in is hella not worth it to me and i found that out quick.

Dispatcher:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.
Wine Taster's Comment
member avatar

Well, I think it is a good thing if it happens. One of the big positives of it passing, drivers would actually log on duty time tarping and doing other work. We all know many people don't log on duty many things they are supposed too. On the flip side, it still will not pay the driver when sitting waiting for a load and things like that because all that time is logged off duty or sleeper berth.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

James K.'s Comment
member avatar

Well, I think it is a good thing if it happens. One of the big positives of it passing, drivers would actually log on duty time tarping and doing other work. We all know many people don't log on duty many things they are supposed too. On the flip side, it still will not pay the driver when sitting waiting for a load and things like that because all that time is logged off duty or sleeper berth.

The loads i was talking about just to clear things are sitting at the dock when your time is running down waiting for the to live load / unload

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Brett Aquila's Comment
member avatar

Well you guys are spouting the typical "truckers against trucking management" and "business owners versus employers" stuff which, as usual, holds very little water. People who have never owned a business always think every business owner is just swimming in cash.

Basically the industry has a revolving door. That's why all these companies hire all the time. Drivers recruiters make money on referrals and lies, companies get a tax break for the new hires. win win _ for them.

Rich, if you have an ounce of sense you'll run out and finance 20 trucks today and get some drivers in those trucks. If owning a trucking company is as simple as raking in the cash and keeping it for yourself by telling a few lies and garnering a few tax write-offs then for God's sake why don't you own a trucking company? Are you scared or something? Go get your share of the pie if you've got it all figured out. Don't just complain about the people making all the money. Become one of those people. It's easy, right?

Companies have the money to pay their drivers more and they just pocket it instead.
James, you should be right on Rich's tail. Get out there and buy yourself some trucks and pocket all that easy money. Why sit around complaining about not getting your share? Go get it!

In recent years Europe has made some changes to their pay for truck drivers. I know almost nothing about it except that it's now focused more on hourly wages than it is on mileage pay.

This is the first I've heard about this Bill being proposed. If they changed over to hourly pay it would turn the entire industry on its head. I have no idea if anything like this would ever see the light of day. The technicalities involved would be enormous. Everything in the industry would change. From the way the janitors mop the floors to the way CEO's conduct meetings and everything in between. It would all be overhauled. Brokers, logistics software, sales negotiations - everything would change. Not to mention a tidal wave of lawsuits going in all directions for years to come.

The other thing you have to consider is this. Right now companies and drivers make money the same way - by keeping those wheels turning. The more freight a company can move the more money they'll make and the more money the drivers will make.

If you change it to an hourly system of some sort you're now riddled with the same problem that all hourly workers and employers of those workers face - you have opposing goals. In an hourly type system the worker wins by doing as little work as possible while riding the clock. The employer wins by squeezing more work out of the workers than they're paying out in wages. So while the employer is trying to work you to death, the employees are trying to get by with as little work as possible. It's a constant bashing of heads and someone is almost always going to lose.

With mileage pay the company and the drivers win or lose together. You're both on the same side. The employers are desperately trying to get all the freight they can and the drivers are trying to turn all the miles possible.

If they came up with a hybrid system of some sort it might not work out too badly. Keep the mileage pay but include a small hourly rate for "on duty, not driving" time. Now here's where this would get interesting. The overwhelming majority of your paycheck would be made turning miles. Now you might get a few bucks an hour riding the "on duty, not driving" line, essentially getting paid to do little or nothing most of the time, but you're also going to be eating into your available on duty time. If you waste time "on duty, not driving" making minimum wage you're not going to have the hours available to turn miles and your paycheck is going to suffer terribly.

So in the end it wouldn't change much of anything. Trucking companies would simply adjust. First of all they'd reward freight based on how efficiently a driver is using his time. For those who want to sit around collecting minimum wage they'll let you do just that most of the time. You'll spend your time making minimum wage sitting in truck stops until you go broke. For those who want to run their tails off and make those big paychecks the company will make sure to help you do so. This is pretty much how things are done today anyhow.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
Jeff L.'s Comment
member avatar

I may be new to this but I like the Idea that I a can achieve by the effort I put in as opposed to everyone getting paid the same rate. I also was hoping joining the trucking industry would get me away from the slackers I have had to work with in the last few years. It is a form of socialism out there with people thinking their jobs are to complain between cigarettes. They are getting paid little with **** poor management. I had a manager who said do not achieve beyond the norm when we could have because it will mess him up paperwork wise for the following year if it could not be reproduced with different workers. This may be one of the last jobs out there that you can achieve by effort.

OWI:

Operating While Intoxicated

Rich D.'s Comment
member avatar

Mr. Brett moderator

I never said I knew it all about trucking. I have been cussed out as a company driver for getting a better load than the lease operator. The company sent a policy statement a few days later telling drivers not to disclose to anyone (even other drivers for the same company) where you were going. Is that deception?

I owned a truck and found they intentionally kept freight rates secret from the drivers. We were supposed to get 80% of the load we found out a different amount being paid by the shipper through info from the shipper. Only way I would own a truck again (not lease) if I got full disclosure. Load confirmation sheets emails invoices for that load. You can throw the broker has to make money too little come back although we were not getting 80% of the money total loads. That is deception.

Its not just the big companies messing up the industry. There is a large group of guys (owner operators) that like to spout "back haul". "I'll run this load and get a back haul when I get there." In other words i will run my truck for cheap. If that's the case everywhere you go its someones "back haul". Everyone fights each other in this business. The job basically ruins a persons life because you never have personal time with your family whats the value on that. As far as recruiting and tax wright offs. Yes a driver will lie to you to get another into orientation. Some of the companies pay drivers for a person just for showing up and signing the book. That's enough incentive to lie. Look at whats going on a driver smacks into your truck at the truckstop and you are taking a shower and drives off without a word. Do you think there is integrity in this business both on the company and driver side.

Back to the OP's topic if this bill did pass everyone would be IC independent contractor 1099 instantly. I know last year was a "great" year for the owner operator I will predict if not already the fuel surcharge will disappear. You will pay that extra for diesel and nothing to show for it. So drivers better learn to do math. How much you need a day to pay for the truck e.g. truck notes insurance licensing. How much you need a mile Fuel & maintenance. This mental attitude the company handles that for me is a bad business model.

Have a happy Easter lets stop the hate drivers. I'm gonna turn my radio off.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Owner Operator:

An owner-operator is a driver who either owns or leases the truck they are driving. A self-employed driver.

SAP:

Substance Abuse Professional

The Substance Abuse Professional (SAP) is a person who evaluates employees who have violated a DOT drug and alcohol program regulation and makes recommendations concerning education, treatment, follow-up testing, and aftercare.

OWI:

Operating While Intoxicated

James K.'s Comment
member avatar

Well you guys are spouting the typical "truckers against trucking management" and "business owners versus employers" stuff which, as usual, holds very little water. People who have never owned a business always think every business owner is just swimming in cash.

double-quotes-start.png

Companies have the money to pay their drivers more and they just pocket it instead.

double-quotes-end.png

James, you should be right on Rich's tail. Get out there and buy yourself some trucks and pocket all that easy money. Why sit around complaining about not getting your share? Go get it!

In recent years Europe has made some changes to their pay for truck drivers. I know almost nothing about it except that it's now focused more on hourly wages than it is on mileage pay.

This is the first I've heard about this Bill being proposed. If they changed over to hourly pay it would turn the entire industry on its head. I have no idea if anything like this would ever see the light of day. The technicalities involved would be enormous. Everything in the industry would change. From the way the janitors mop the floors to the way CEO's conduct meetings and everything in between. It would all be overhauled. Brokers, logistics software, sales negotiations - everything would change. Not to mention a tidal wave of lawsuits going in all directions for years to come.

The other thing you have to consider is this. Right now companies and drivers make money the same way - by keeping those wheels turning. The more freight a company can move the more money they'll make and the more money the drivers will make.

If you change it to an hourly system of some sort you're now riddled with the same problem that all hourly workers and employers of those workers face - you have opposing goals. In an hourly type system the worker wins by doing as little work as possible while riding the clock. The employer wins by squeezing more work out of the workers than they're paying out in wages. So while the employer is trying to work you to death, the employees are trying to get by with as little work as possible. It's a constant bashing of heads and someone is almost always going to lose.

With mileage pay the company and the drivers win or lose together. You're both on the same side. The employers are desperately trying to get all the freight they can and the drivers are trying to turn all the miles possible.

If they came up with a hybrid system of some sort it might not work out too badly. Keep the mileage pay but include a small hourly rate for "on duty, not driving" time. Now here's where this would get interesting. The overwhelming majority of your paycheck would be made turning miles. Now you might get a few bucks an hour riding the "on duty, not driving" line, essentially getting paid to do little or nothing most of the time, but you're also going to be eating into your available on duty time. If you waste time "on duty, not driving" making minimum wage you're not going to have the hours available to turn miles and your paycheck is going to suffer terribly.

So in the end it wouldn't change much of anything. Trucking companies would simply adjust. First of all they'd reward freight based on how efficiently a driver is using his time. For those who want to sit around collecting minimum wage they'll let you do just that most of the time. You'll spend your time making minimum wage sitting in truck stops until you go broke. For those who want to run their tails off and make those big paychecks the company will make sure to help you do so. This is pretty much how things are done today anyhow.

Trucking companies are like any other major corporation out there man. Im talking swift, werner etc... The CEO's of those company probably rake in millions if not billions while their drivers are on the road 330 days out of the year missing life events and working 70 hour weeks just to try and earn 1000 a week and usually come up short.

Then i find out that these companies also make somewhere around 300 a day per person in there orientation hotel rooms waiting to get out. So they keep the drivers they know either aren't going to medically clear or mainly background stuff just to keep a warm body in the room until the next orientation then tell them they couldn't hire them and send them packing on the greyhound. I am just stating these companies are just as greedy as any other corp. out there. and thats their right but they want to know why they can't keep new drivers.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
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