Two Right Turn Lanes....

Topic 20598 | Page 9

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Stephanie K.'s Comment
member avatar

Thank you Rainy. That is exactly what I meant. When I first started driving a car I was taught that is how you refer to both turning lanes. When relaying directions if you needed to make a left after the two right turning lanes you would say, " make a gradual right, then a left". Etc....

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

She means if you are making a turn, the inside lane is "extreme" as in a harder turn, whereas the outside lane is "gradual". basically she agrees that they easy turn would be the outermost lane.

Thanks for “dummying-it-down” for a “dummy”.

Grumpy Old Man's Comment
member avatar

To add fuel to the fire, I asked my instructor today. His answer was the right lane. When I pointed out if he encroached on the left lane it would be on his blind side, he said then I would wait. He said it is on NY's road test in some areas.

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

To add fuel to the fire, I asked my instructor today. His answer was the right lane. When I pointed out if he encroached on the left lane it would be on his blind side, he said then I would wait. He said it is on NY's road test in some areas.

Here is some of that from me...

Ask your instructor to show you the guidance for executing a right turn when there are two marked right turn lanes in the NY State CDL manual. There “isn’t any” so not sure what rule is supporting his point. Guidance for two right turn lanes are not covered at all, as if they don’t cust. Unless the manual has been updated, I guess he is applying basic RH turn rules for a two lane configuration. Not sure.

The inverse? There is very clear instructions on executing a turn where two left turn lanes exist. It clearly states (with a diagram) use the outer lane, or right most lane of the two lanes for turning left.

Do what yah gotta do to pass the test. That’s important.

Once you are out here though, you’ll quickly realize the absurdity of what your instructor has suggested. Intersections where this configuration exists are in very, very congested areas and designed to speed the flow of traffic.

CDL:

Commercial Driver's License (CDL)

A CDL is required to drive any of the following vehicles:

  • Any combination of vehicles with a gross combined weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 or more pounds, providing the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing another not in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any vehicle, regardless of size, designed to transport 16 or more persons, including the driver.
  • Any vehicle required by federal regulations to be placarded while transporting hazardous materials.
Grumpy Old Man's Comment
member avatar

double-quotes-start.png

To add fuel to the fire, I asked my instructor today. His answer was the right lane. When I pointed out if he encroached on the left lane it would be on his blind side, he said then I would wait. He said it is on NY's road test in some areas.

double-quotes-end.png

Here is some of that from me...

Ask your instructor to show you the guidance for executing a right turn when there are two marked right turn lanes in the NY State CDL manual. There “isn’t any” so not sure what rule is supporting his point. Guidance for two right turn lanes are not covered at all, as if they don’t cust. Unless the manual has been updated, I guess he is applying basic RH turn rules for a two lane configuration. Not sure.

The inverse? There is very clear instructions on executing a turn where two left turn lanes exist. It clearly states (with a diagram) use the outer lane, or right most lane of the two lanes for turning left.

Do what yah gotta do to pass the test. That’s important.

Once you are out here though, you’ll quickly realize the absurdity of what your instructor has suggested. Intersections where this configuration exists are in very, very congested areas and designed to speed the flow of traffic.

I've got exactly 10 hours of on road driving, and I see the wisdom of using the outermost lane.

And he wasn't saying just to pass the test, he said he had been in may intersections like that, and always used the right lane. I said, but if someone is in the left hand right turn lane, and you encroach on them, they will be on your blind side. His answer is he would wait until the left was clear, because it is too easy to trap someone on the right side.

I said, but at least you would be able to see the right side. That is when he said NY has a road course somewhere where you have to use the right lane. Luckily, it isn't where I am going.

CDL:

Commercial Driver's License (CDL)

A CDL is required to drive any of the following vehicles:

  • Any combination of vehicles with a gross combined weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 or more pounds, providing the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing another not in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any vehicle, regardless of size, designed to transport 16 or more persons, including the driver.
  • Any vehicle required by federal regulations to be placarded while transporting hazardous materials.
Robsteeler's Comment
member avatar

I had this question too. I'm glad someone asked because I forgot about it. Needless to say, I picked the wrong lane. It was really tough with cars on my left, finally, I just let them all get past then I went. Just doing it made me see that I should have picked the outside lane. It is confusing the first time you encounter it.

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

I had this question too. I'm glad someone asked because I forgot about it. Needless to say, I picked the wrong lane. It was really tough with cars on my left, finally, I just let them all get past then I went. Just doing it made me see that I should have picked the outside lane. It is confusing the first time you encounter it.

That’s great confirmation Rob.

G-Town's Comment
member avatar
And he wasn't saying just to pass the test, he said he had been in may intersections like that, and always used the right lane. I said, but if someone is in the left hand right turn lane, and you encroach on them, they will be on your blind side. His answer is he would wait until the left was clear, because it is too easy to trap someone on the right side.

I could NOT disagree with him more.

My reply to him would be take it slow and “maintain your lane”, you won’t trap anyone in the rightmost lane because you won’t be in the right lane. If you can’t maintain your lane (as an experience driver should) then you’ve got bigger issues to conquer.

Every “two right turning lanes” configuration I’ve encountered in PA and NJ, the rightmost lane is marked

No Trucks

. Highly conspicuous signage. There is a big reason for this. The turning radius is too tight and there are likely obstructions that you cannot clear.

Graduate, get your CDL and take his guidance on this particular topic with a significant grain of salt. Read what Rob Steeler wrote previous to my reply...he is a retired LEO.

CDL:

Commercial Driver's License (CDL)

A CDL is required to drive any of the following vehicles:

  • Any combination of vehicles with a gross combined weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 or more pounds, providing the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing another not in excess of 10,000 pounds.
  • Any vehicle, regardless of size, designed to transport 16 or more persons, including the driver.
  • Any vehicle required by federal regulations to be placarded while transporting hazardous materials.
Dave Reid's Comment
member avatar

Bruce, I wrote that stuff a long time ago, before veterans here rightly straightened me out. This is an old thread....please ignore what I wrote. Dave

double-quotes-start.png

The multiple turn lane treatment will need to vary a bit depending on the design of the intersection. But what I normally do is initially get in the right lane but as I approach the intersection I move the tractor into the outer lane, leaving the trailer tandems in the right lane. I turn using the outer lane but keeping the wheels close enough to the curb that a car can't get by. This usually lets me complete the turn quickly, only briefly blocking multiple lanes. It insures that I won't hit anything, including a 4 wheeler, on the right side, gives me room to avoid any obstacles, and lets me see what is on the left if anyone tries to sneak up there. I've been doing this for several months now and it works like a charm. If for some reason I could not do this, I'd do the whole thing from the outer lane as Brett described.

double-quotes-end.png

In my training what Dave Reid is describing was called the "button hook" turn. We were taught that if we approached an intersection and weren't sure we would have enough room (like a blind corner) to button hook it. This was deemed so important to making safe turns that we spent quite a bit of time practicing it.

Tandems:

Tandem Axles

A set of axles spaced close together, legally defined as more than 40 and less than 96 inches apart by the USDOT. Drivers tend to refer to the tandem axles on their trailer as just "tandems". You might hear a driver say, "I'm 400 pounds overweight on my tandems", referring to his trailer tandems, not his tractor tandems. Tractor tandems are generally just referred to as "drives" which is short for "drive axles".

Tandem:

Tandem Axles

A set of axles spaced close together, legally defined as more than 40 and less than 96 inches apart by the USDOT. Drivers tend to refer to the tandem axles on their trailer as just "tandems". You might hear a driver say, "I'm 400 pounds overweight on my tandems", referring to his trailer tandems, not his tractor tandems. Tractor tandems are generally just referred to as "drives" which is short for "drive axles".

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

Dave replied to Bruce...

Bruce, I wrote that stuff a long time ago, before veterans here rightly straightened me out. This is an old thread....please ignore what I wrote. Dave

double-quotes-start.png

double-quotes-start.png

double-quotes-start.png

The multiple turn lane treatment will need to vary a bit depending on the design of the intersection. But what I normally do is initially get in the right lane but as I approach the intersection I move the tractor into the outer lane, leaving the trailer tandems in the right lane. I turn using the outer lane but keeping the wheels close enough to the curb that a car can't get by. This usually lets me complete the turn quickly, only briefly blocking multiple lanes. It insures that I won't hit anything, including a 4 wheeler, on the right side, gives me room to avoid any obstacles, and lets me see what is on the left if anyone tries to sneak up there. I've been doing this for several months now and it works like a charm. If for some reason I could not do this, I'd do the whole thing from the outer lane as Brett described.

double-quotes-end.png

double-quotes-end.png

In my training what Dave Reid is describing was called the "button hook" turn. We were taught that if we approached an intersection and weren't sure we would have enough room (like a blind corner) to button hook it. This was deemed so important to making safe turns that we spent quite a bit of time practicing it.

double-quotes-end.png

And your real-world experience Dave?

That definitely played into the change-of-mind. Experience is always the best teacher. None better.

“C’mon back...”

I think your feedback would be huge for closing the loop on the difference between what is initially perceived as “right” and “correct” vs. the adjusted reality of first-hand experience.

Tandems:

Tandem Axles

A set of axles spaced close together, legally defined as more than 40 and less than 96 inches apart by the USDOT. Drivers tend to refer to the tandem axles on their trailer as just "tandems". You might hear a driver say, "I'm 400 pounds overweight on my tandems", referring to his trailer tandems, not his tractor tandems. Tractor tandems are generally just referred to as "drives" which is short for "drive axles".

Tandem:

Tandem Axles

A set of axles spaced close together, legally defined as more than 40 and less than 96 inches apart by the USDOT. Drivers tend to refer to the tandem axles on their trailer as just "tandems". You might hear a driver say, "I'm 400 pounds overweight on my tandems", referring to his trailer tandems, not his tractor tandems. Tractor tandems are generally just referred to as "drives" which is short for "drive axles".

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