Understanding Personal Conveyance

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BK's Comment
member avatar

There is a new tool in my tool box that I didn’t have before, the personal conveyance feature. I understand that it can’t be used to advance a load, but can it be utilized to get to a safe parking spot when your clock is about to expire?

Example: For whatever reason, my 11 hour clock only has five minutes left on it. I’m allowed one hour of PC per day. Can I put myself on PC and then go to a parking location? Let’s say I’ve planned to stop for my 10 hour break at Loves but when I get there it is totally full. Now I only have a few minutes left. Can PC be used to drive to another place to park? And what if there is a Pilot 5 miles down the road that I call and they still have spaces open. But to go to Pilot, I will be advancing the load 5 miles closer to my destination. What would I be able to do in that scenario?

And does the “safe haven” concept come into play here?

Stevo Reno's Comment
member avatar

Safe Haven and PC 2 totally different things...we are allowed 30 minutes PC where I am, and safe haven is a 2 hour window, to find, safe haven to park. lol PC I think is more for driving say to wal-mart for food? I've never used it. When explained we are only allowed 30 minutes by the company, it takes longer than that to go shop lol

Couple weeks ago, I was getting live unloaded (rare), Well by time they finished and I moved from the dock ready to check out, my time was -3 minutes. I logged off duty, used the safe haven option, and rushed out to get to our drop lot in Fontana.....Never used this either, but couldn't get safety on the phone, and figured I got's to go !!! I can't park anyplace in Commerce, Calif. Really don't know whats the point to log to off duty to access the safe haven, if logically, once you go into drive mode, you're IN DRIVE? lol

Took me an hour and 9 minutes, "HOS red flagged" to get to our drop lot, get parked, THEN I called safety. He had me go to split sleeper, and check the box, it reversed my -1:09 into positive, hence NO HOS violation, then I went on SB, and slept lol.....Really, not like I really cared 1 way or the other of a HOS issue, not like I get inspected on the road, and it lasts 8 days? And I am done driving trucks in 2 weeks now, for good !!

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
Stevo Reno's Comment
member avatar

Error safety had me go to my Qualcom main screen, and check mark the tiny box under, your hours to regain . Check "Will Pair SB" box, then the minus 1 hour 9 minutes, changed to positive time= no violation now....

Orientation they told us we can't edit our logs, LOL Yeah right !! I edit em all the time, changing or remarks for the 1 minute, 5 minutes, etc BS moving within customers yard, trailer hunting etc....Stupid part is 4+ mph shifts you into drive, when most DC's, like XPO, Fed Ex, UPS, have 10-15 mph yard speeds, not easy to stay under 4 mph in that scenario searching for your empty or loaded trailer

G-Town's Comment
member avatar

Safe Haven has nothing to do with PC. It’s a misunderstood, misused term that only applies to the safe parking of a CMV with active HAZMAT placards. As such, parking on an off-ramp is not considered a Safe Haven for a HAZMAT load.

Please read this:

FMCSA PC

Once you read this, it might be a good idea to have a discussion with your driver leader to understand if they have additional policy and procedure regarding this.

HAZMAT:

Hazardous Materials

Explosive, flammable, poisonous or otherwise potentially dangerous cargo. Large amounts of especially hazardous cargo are required to be placarded under HAZMAT regulations

CSA:

Compliance, Safety, Accountability (CSA)

The CSA is a Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) initiative to improve large truck and bus safety and ultimately reduce crashes, injuries, and fatalities that are related to commercial motor vehicle

FMCSA:

Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

The FMCSA was established within the Department of Transportation on January 1, 2000. Their primary mission is to prevent commercial motor vehicle-related fatalities and injuries.

What Does The FMCSA Do?

  • Commercial Drivers' Licenses
  • Data and Analysis
  • Regulatory Compliance and Enforcement
  • Research and Technology
  • Safety Assistance
  • Support and Information Sharing

DOT:

Department Of Transportation

A department of the federal executive branch responsible for the national highways and for railroad and airline safety. It also manages Amtrak, the national railroad system, and the Coast Guard.

State and Federal DOT Officers are responsible for commercial vehicle enforcement. "The truck police" you could call them.

CMV:

Commercial Motor Vehicle

A CMV is a vehicle that is used as part of a business, is involved in interstate commerce, and may fit any of these descriptions:

  • Weighs 10,001 pounds or more
  • Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating of 10,001 pounds or more
  • Is designed or used to transport 16 or more passengers (including the driver) not for compensation
  • Is designed or used to transport 9 or more passengers (including the driver) for compensation
  • Is transporting hazardous materials in a quantity requiring placards

Fm:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.
Old School's Comment
member avatar

Well Bruce, now you know why Schneider decided it was best to not allow you to have that tool. Seriously, this is one area that drives people nuts. They want to use PC as a crutch to keep them from violating the log rules, and having to plan their days properly. I have a fellow driver on my dedicated account who advances his load with it all the time. He claims it is legal because it does not show up as a red warning on his logs. That is so dumb! He doesn't even understand the rules. How can a driver make himself into a productive member of the team if he doesn't even understand the rules he is supposed to be working with. What's worse is that some of the major carriers don't even understand the rules.

Stevo's response was disheartening and enlightening at the same time. I knew when I first saw your question that there would be some crazy comments on this subject. Part of the problem with your question stems from you throwing that totally misunderstood phrase "safe haven" into the mix. There is no such "safe haven" ever mentioned in the FMCSA green book except in relation to a HazMat load. I hear truckers using the phrase "safe haven" all the time as a truck stop that has empty parking spaces. That's nonsense. Nowhere does the FMCSA have a definition like that. So forget about looking for a "safe haven" unless you are hauling hazmat. That safe haven is not for the driver. It is a place that keeps the public safe from your hazmat load. or maybe it keeps your hazmat load safe from being involved in an accident. It has nothing to do with you not planning your day out so that you have time to park.

What was disheartening about Stevo's response was that he didn't really know the rules. What was enlightening, or perhaps encouraging, is that his company understood how to extend his 14 hour clock by using the split sleeper berth rule. There are companies who still don't allow drivers to use this rule. Schneider may be one of them, I don't know. Here is what I can say. I have used these rules since the beginning of my career and they have helped me be more productive and safe. They are there to allow you to deal with various issues that we all face now and then. You should learn them and make use of them if your company allows. Many companies enforce their own additional rules concerning PC. You need to know what those are also.

I remember when I went to truck driving school I already had learned how the split sleeper berth rule worked because I saw in it great possibilities to help me in certain situations. I had been studying all these things right here on Trucking Truth long before I ever started in school. When we got to the part about logs in school the teacher never mentioned any of the wonderful things I had learned about the split sleeper berth. Out of curiosity I asked them why they hadn't mentioned that rule. Their response was, "It is too damn hard to understand." That meant they didn't know anything about it and didn't want to discuss it.

I wish we had more information about your particular situation - maybe this is all speculation - I can't tell. It would have been helpful if we knew how the rest of your day had been spent. If you had two or more consecutive hours of waiting at a shipper or receiver you could have possibly used the split sleeper and not even had this problem of running out of time. Your example says you left the shipper and went to Loves for a parking spot. When you got there it was full and you had to keep going. You act like you are loaded so whatever you do is advancing your load according to your scenario's specifics. I'm fairly certain an officer would interpret it that way, and he would be correct.

Until you are confident you understand the rules keep it simple. Use PC for when you are off duty for a ten hour break. You can then simply use your tractor to go to the grocery for groceries, or maybe to a restaurant for a meal. Maybe \you need to go to a laundromat and do your laundry. Just put it on PC, make a note explaining what you are doing. Here's an example: I have been off duty for one and a half hours. I decide I want to go to Jose's Mexican Restaurant for some tamales. I put my logs on PC. I make a note something like "going to a restaurant for a meal." It is as simple as that. When I arrive at the restaurant I put my logs back on "off duty" and make a note saying, "continuing break." When I finish my meal, and am returning to my parking area, I put my logs back to PC with a note saying, "returning to parking area." Then when I am parked I put my logs back to "off duty" or "sleeper berth" (whichever is pertinent) and I state in the notes that I have, "returned to parking area."

Now... you have to be careful with this stuff. If you have extended your fourteen hour clock with a two hour break like Stevo's company advised him to do, then you must log eight hours in the sleeper berth before you use a PC move. Otherwise you are creating a violation.

Continued...

HAZMAT:

Hazardous Materials

Explosive, flammable, poisonous or otherwise potentially dangerous cargo. Large amounts of especially hazardous cargo are required to be placarded under HAZMAT regulations

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

CSA:

Compliance, Safety, Accountability (CSA)

The CSA is a Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) initiative to improve large truck and bus safety and ultimately reduce crashes, injuries, and fatalities that are related to commercial motor vehicle

FMCSA:

Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

The FMCSA was established within the Department of Transportation on January 1, 2000. Their primary mission is to prevent commercial motor vehicle-related fatalities and injuries.

What Does The FMCSA Do?

  • Commercial Drivers' Licenses
  • Data and Analysis
  • Regulatory Compliance and Enforcement
  • Research and Technology
  • Safety Assistance
  • Support and Information Sharing

Fm:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.

OWI:

Operating While Intoxicated

Old School's Comment
member avatar

You have got plenty of resources to learn these rules. Learn them before you start trying to play around with them. I can give you a lot of details, but I don't want to make your brain hurt. It is best that you learn the rules before trying to use them. DO NOT depend on what other drivers tell you. They are the same ones who came up with this "Safe Haven" B.S. that is still around after all these years. There is no such thing for a driver, and yet people use it as an excuse all the time to find a parking spot. The best cure for a scenario like you describe is a good understanding of the rules and a good plan for your day.

I am not condemning anybody who has a bad day and things don't go as planned. I understand we all have those kind of days out here. Sometime nothing goes right, but we still learn to deal with it. This all falls under the category of being a professional out here on the road. Don't push yourself so much that you can't accomplish what you need to in a day. Work under the rules we have and know when you are legal or not. It is great to ask these kinds of questions because it helps us realize how little we really understand about our chosen career.

Bruce, you were a carpenter. I'll bet you came across carpenters all the time who didn't know how to calculate the measurements for building a stair case. I hope you know how, and could explain it to the newbies. I am using that as an example that maybe you can relate to, I don't really know, maybe you never understood how to use a speed square to help you calculate a set of stairs, but you should have known how to do that. This is the same kind of deal. Learn the rules and learn how to use them in your career. It is not everyday you will need to know these things, but they are extremely important when you actually do have a scenario where you need them.

I've been long winded (forgive me) but for me there is no easy answer to what you asked. I want drivers to be professionals. For years my driver manager has wanted me to teach a class on the log book rules. He realizes how my understanding of them helps me make more money than his other drivers. He also realizes he could be making more money if every driver could be more productive. The reason we have never set up a class is because of the constant influx and exit of drivers. We would be wasting our time if nobody stays and practices what they learn.

Driver Manager:

Dispatcher, Fleet Manager, Driver Manager

The primary person a driver communicates with at his/her company. A dispatcher can play many roles, depending on the company's structure. Dispatchers may assign freight, file requests for home time, relay messages between the driver and management, inform customer service of any delays, change appointment times, and report information to the load planners.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
Old School's Comment
member avatar

An additional note to my reply...

My friend who uses the PC line for advancing his load got a call from the logs department recently. They placed him on probation. He now understands why I have been telling him to not do that. He got really irritated and threatened to quit over it. He says he can't make any money now. confused.gif

Old School's Comment
member avatar
Your example says you left the shipper and went to Loves for a parking spot. When you got there it was full and you had to keep going. You act like you are loaded so whatever you do is advancing your load according to your scenario's specifics. I'm fairly certain an officer would interpret it that way, and he would be correct.

In reading my response, that statement sounds confusing. You can use PC when loaded. You cannot advance your load. Bruce's example stated he would be going in the direction the load was intended for. You can go to a restaurant or a grocery store when loaded. What you want to do is go do your personal errands and then return to your parking area. Remember Keep it simple and you shouldn't have too many issues with PC.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Old School's Comment
member avatar

You can also use PC to get to a parking area if you have run out of legal time at a shipper (even if if goes in the direction of advancing the load). That is part of the design of the rule. Just be careful that you are using the rules properly. If you could have used the split sleeper to extend your clock and didn't, then you have set yourself up for a violation. That is precisely the scenario that Stevo presented. His company helped him straighten it out, but he must put himself on sleeper berth when he gets parked. He has to stay on sleeper berth until the number of hours he spends there equals ten when added to the prior break he took to extend his clock.

Is that confusing? I thought it would be, but these rules are not all that simple. Brett once stated that we could have found a room full of drunk monkeys to come up with some better rules than we are working with.

I actually like the latest renditions of the rules. They are helpful and have taken a turn back towards the way they used to be back in the good old days of trucking.

Shipper:

The customer who is shipping the freight. This is where the driver will pick up a load and then deliver it to the receiver or consignee.

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

BK's Comment
member avatar

Old School, wow, that was great info, thanks.

Just to clarify, my question contained a purely theoretical scenario, not one I got myself into. Friday night I got to my destination with 90 minutes left on my clock and last night I parked at a rest area with 40 minutes left on my clock. I’m just trying to learn the rules because this is new to me. Like you correctly stated, Schneider prohibits PC so I never gave it much thought. The sleeper berth issue is something I will learn, but as you say it’s complicated. One step at a time.

Btw, I drove 1136 miles total Friday and Saturday, my first two driving with Helwig. I have about 300 miles to go today to get to my delivery near Madison, WI. I’m still in the learning phase with the reefer and Omnitrac but making progress in those areas. So, my first assignment that I should complete today is about 1400 miles. The company told me that if I want to be a 3000 mile per week driver, they will feed me assignments to make that happen. So far, so good!

Sleeper Berth:

The portion of the tractor behind the seats which acts as the "living space" for the driver. It generally contains a bed (or bunk beds), cabinets, lights, temperature control knobs, and 12 volt plugs for power.

Reefer:

A refrigerated trailer.

HOS:

Hours Of Service

HOS refers to the logbook hours of service regulations.
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